The nerfing that has been going on

Number of posts : 8 Registration date : 2009-01-09

I want to start this by saying that i am in no way insulting anyone in this post, merely broadcasting my opinions in hope others may agree or disagree and we can have a civilized discussion about this.

Over the past few weeks we have almost all fell victim to a nerf of one kind or another, some of us more than others. I just read a post from hahawoot about his nerfing of the dark avenger. I am very worried with the nerfing that has been done. Some of the things i have noticed is many fighter classes have been nerfed, but yet spellhowlers hurricane has been increased? In a tvt an unbuffed howler hits possibly 4,000? In my opinion the nerf's are slowly taking their tole on everyone. I understand that many of the nerfs and increases were done with good intentions but there has to be a line. Overlords are overpowered and needed a nerf, that is no question. Dualists havent been very good in the past and could have used a bonus, that is no question. But goign through and completely changing what character are is crossing a line in my opinion. For example a dagger. Daggers' have lost lethal rate, lost critical rate, lost atk speed. Dark avengers have lost pretty much any hope they have besides UD. I understand the argument that no character should reach max attack speed in the case of daggers but if you make a tattoo 15% atk speed, and then an armor set +15% atk speed, how can you be suprised? You cant make those types of things, then nerf the attack speed.

I cant speek on behalf of all classes, but i believe i can speek with quite confidence about daggers (or at least a TH). There is little reason to play a dagger if the next nerf goes through and lowers our attack speed. Going against a mage i have absolutly no chance. Using all my speed buffs i still cant even get into contact with a mage before getting hit 5 times, and being dead. Even if i get up close, what is my options. Trick? Bluff? Both of which hardly land in my adventures. When facing a paladin what can i do? When i faught hahawoot he was doing more damage through physical mirror than i could do. He didnt hit me once, he just stood in place and i killed myself. Once his 81 skills work the same will happen through my skills. and now with counter-dash with archers a dagger has no chance of catching up to an archer unless the dagger is an elf.

So to sum up

Mage > Dagger
Pali/DA > Dagger
Archer > Dagger

And i am not saying the dagger has been the only class effected, many of the others have been and i encourage anyone else who has noticed these to please post and say what your opinion is. I merely use the dagger example because that is what i experience the most. I appreciate all input, and would love to hear what the GM's think of this as well.

Please keep flaming out of the thread.

-Alan

Number of posts : 20 Registration date : 2009-01-05

yeah i totally agree that there is some disproportional nerfing. one clan member called cloud joined the server and when he made a SK and got it 81 the first thing he asked was, "why wont any of my skills land on people or mobs?" he then made a necro and came to the same conclusion. The simple solution sometimes is to follow the game creatiors idea, for example in stuns. stuns should have a lower chance of landing on races such as orcs and dwarves, but should have a greater chance on mages, especially elves and dark elves. Another example is the debuffing. Mage debuffs should land more on classes such as daggers or archers or fighters, but not as high on other mages. Also, skills that are done at close range and have similar effects as long range skills should have a better land rate because of the range difference, and classes that have better then average casting speed or matk are supposed to make up for it in a lack of another attribute. Light elves are supposed to have more casting speed but at the cost of their INT, as well as they have better run speed, at cost of their CON. Dark elves have better INT and suffer with their WIT. In khaos's case, the daggers were nerfed in their advantage over mages which is bluff and trick. When a dagger gets near a mage it shouldnt take too long for the mage to drop, but without the vital skills of bluff or trick your just a near useless class hitting a mage for less then they life drain you for.

Number of posts : 38 Registration date : 2008-12-28

as i am a glad on almost all servers I am happy for the most part here cause i come close on almost all my matches some i get lucky and get a crit to win but for the most part in even compitition (u all hear that EVEN) we are as good as it gets.

the new one we do pwn is the dagger ur evasion has us beat but it I survive ur ult. evasion and u dont get a skill to land (and latly u wont) and u run out of mp ur screwed.

Some mages are op aka spellhowler but they are supposed to be the strongest mages around so no supprise there.

tanks well n ow that stun doesnt land and there slow as hell I can kite them lol.

Number of posts : 8 Registration date : 2009-01-09

Absolutly, spellhowlers are supposed to be the most powerful mage in the game. But the fact that a dagger cant even get to one before it dies is unbalanced. I understand that it should be powerful, but there should be a line. Another thing i noticed is when i was on my howler, the mp consumption for hurricane was changed. This makes them extremely unbalanced in oly. PArt of being a mage is you have to watch your mana in oly, but instead, howlers dont have to worry about that at all.

Number of posts : 20 Registration date : 2009-01-05

overlords cant even get some classes to half health before running out of mana, however i see spellhowlers having enough mana to nuke me through 30 seconds of vengeance, 30 seconds of UD, 15 seconds of sof and 30 secodns of anti magic armor and still having enough mana to battle heal themselves from 1/4 hp to full. i played a elven elder and he had enough mana to nuke me, get to 25% hp, transform, heal himself to full, transform, nuke, transform, heal and about 4 times total with at the end having 40% mana left. bullcrap?

Number of posts : 34 Registration date : 2009-01-01

thesaba wrote:: overlords cant even get some classes to half health before running out of mana, however i see spellhowlers having enough mana to nuke me through 30 seconds of vengeance, 30 seconds of UD, 15 seconds of sof and 30 secodns of anti magic armor and still having enough mana to battle heal themselves from 1/4 hp to full. i played a elven elder and he had enough mana to nuke me, get to 25% hp, transform, heal himself to full, transform, nuke, transform, heal and about 4 times total with at the end having 40% mana left. bullcrap?

Well knowing that I had +men-int dyes and Clarity buff, that's not really a surprise,

Btw there was only 20% mana left ^^

Number of posts : 46 Registration date : 2009-01-05

Alan wrote:: Absolutly, spellhowlers are supposed to be the most powerful mage in the game. But the fact that a dagger cant even get to one before it dies is unbalanced. I understand that it should be powerful, but there should be a line. Another thing i noticed is when i was on my howler, the mp consumption for hurricane was changed. This makes them extremely unbalanced in oly. PArt of being a mage is you have to watch your mana in oly, but instead, howlers dont have to worry about that at all.

Don't know how much SH have been 'boosted' but I can guarantee that's the only class that has been upped to that extent. My sorc/sps doesn't hit for more than 1k with 8200 matk... Its depressing Neutral

Number of posts : 34 Registration date : 2009-01-01

Well ressistances play a big part in this too,
let's say you have all the ressistances on, then SPH won't hit u more than 250dmg even if he has 10k m.att

Number of posts : 20 Registration date : 2009-01-05

i always have all the resist elements/dances on my tank buffs.

Subject: Here it goes :S Sun Jan 11, 2009 1:52 am

I know there is Staff posting lacking on this post but here we go.

Today (Sunday) I will be running tests on classes.

If I do end up seeing some class being OPed, or UPed I will make adjustments.

Debuffs do land quite a bit now.
Atk Speed is upped now.
Shield Slam/Stun is upped now.
Shackle is upped now.
Lethal is upped now.

A quick recap: Custom stuff is added to make the server more attractive. They do add good stats, but there is no point in having 1550 Atk speed or 1750 cast speed. I will be adding cloaks soon, those will also add bonuses.

Adding custom stuff and then readjusting the buffs isn't as bad as adding NO custom stuff IMHO.

This would have not been an issue if During BETA, if I didn't just give out all the gear, and stuff like that, but I just couldn't say no to my players. And I'm still having a hard time saying no to you guys...

Everything will be the way it makes sense, trust me on that one.

To Alan:
I haven't touched the Mp consumption rate, only to retain retail Oly.